Comments on: Without Attacks on Anyone Believer and Un-Believer Alike?

By: B.K.R.A.K. v. 2.1.3

B.K.R.A.K. v. 2.1.3 — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 16:34:01 +0000

ummm 3 years straight painkiller habit. When no oc was available, I substituted with smack. Quit- dealt with the withdrawls (“clean” since early 2005- but I still smoke weed). No 12 step… once again- you’re full of it.

By: therealdeal

therealdeal — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 16:10:38 +0000

I am a Christian, and I also work in Mental Health – Addiction – for a doctor at a Rehab Facility. While I know too, just how successful a 12 Step Program including God can be in helping people overcome their addictions, I have seen one or two patients who seem to have pulled their lives together and are currently sober who did not use a 12 step program. Both do have a belief in a higher power though – one a Christian, one happens to be Muslim. Both are on long term prescription drugs intended to keep their cravings at bay. They are missing the support that others in a 12 step program could provide. Of the patients we have who claim no religious belief in a higher power – we do seem to see more struggle, more falling back into their addiction, more non-compliance with treatment, etc. We’re not the only one’s who notice this, several of the doctors and staff were discussing this very topic just the other day.

To sum up, yes, I think it is POSSIBLE for some people to overcome their addiction without having a strong faith or using a 12 Step Program, but I also think it’s much harder. As a Christian, I do believe that God will help us through any of our trials (even addictions) if we ask him to, trust him and do our part too.

To J.P. – it’s AWESOME that your Dad was able to make a change in his drinking habits that quickly. It’s called sheer willpower, and for a VERY FEW – I mean VERY FEW – it has and can work this way. HOWEVER – there really are people, many, many people who – if they even taste one drop of alcohol – really will find their lives destroyed by their addiction again and will be full-fledged active alcoholics. 12 Step Programs for Alcoholics, as well as other 12 Steps for Narcotics, etc. are wonderful programs that help TONS of addicts maintain a drug/alcohol free lifestyle. One of the 12 Steps is acknowledging that there is a higher power who can help you.

I also agree whole-heartedly with JG-OR ” the person does not work on who they are deep down, how they perceive themselves, and any issues they have stuffed down.” << 12 Step and other Addiction Recovery programs, if worked hard, honestly and correctly can help a person with all three of these things.

Good luck and many blessings to all who struggle with addiction – even those who aren’t ready to deal with it yet.

By: hog b

hog b — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 15:41:56 +0000

Yes they can, but it’s not as easy.
However much I’ve tried to believe in God, I find it impossible.
In the 12 step programme God replaces the “dependence”, which is at the heart of addictions, it’s not much to do with physical dependence, (that is over fairly rapidly) He also does your willpower for you.
God fills the hole that was previously filled by alcohol/drugs. It works very well for very many people who retain sobriety.
I see nothing essentially wrong with that if it works for them.
However some people, like myself, prefer to deal with problems ourselves, and with help from the temporal world, as we cannot delude ourselves to the extent of believing in some sort of personal God, or the Higher Power as he is refered to in the 12 step programme.
The way that I regained sobriety was with cognitive behavioral therapy, it was the hardest “thinking” work I have ever done in my life, it is not easy, and you need to really want to “get sober”.
Having been to AA meetings, and heard about people doing the steps, I thank God that I didn’t have to involve him, or go to those meetings, which were just not me.
Good luck to those that it works for, and also good luck to those who want to get sober by other means, it is pure propaganda to say that the 12 steps is the only way to retain sobriety.

By: EvolvedKW

EvolvedKW — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 15:14:01 +0000

Many people get sober without and kind of god. There are hundreds of secular 12 step type programs, that naturally you have never heard of because you can’t take your air filled head out of a bible for 5 seconds.

By: Madeline Bassett

Madeline Bassett — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 14:20:27 +0000

I have two Uncles and one Aunt who got sober without the Spiritual Path of a 12 step. And they’ve been sober for years.

By: JG-OR

JG-OR — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:34:07 +0000

I think their are many paths to becoming sober. It all comes down to the individuals desire to become clean. I think this applies to any form of addiction, chemical or physical.

It is not about a 12 step program or any other form of sobriety. I believe any addiction comes down to the persons heart, do they want, in the core of their being, to become clean. If so, then a 12 step program or any other program can work. Take it one step farther, if, at the same time, the person does not work on who they are deep down, how they perceive themselves, and any issues they have stuffed down. The last three things I mentioned is where true freedom is found, not in 12 steps or even will power!

I admire your compassion and willingness to be used to help people. YOU ROCK SISTER FRIEND!

By: MS

MS — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 12:35:42 +0000

This is a logical fallacy called “noble lie”. Some people get well due the hope in god doesn’t mean that god exist.

So are you telling me people can get sober without the Spiritual Path of a 12 Step???
Yes they can it is called placebo effect, and it has been scientifically demonstrated also.

By: Luci

Luci — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 12:03:09 +0000

The part that they don’t tell you, is that a person has the same chance of recovery with or without a 12 step program and a “higher power”. The percentage of success is equal either way!

By: Elizabeth W

Elizabeth W — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:44:40 +0000

There are other recovery programs out there that are not spirituality based. Secular Organizations for Sobriety is one. They have people who come through them and get sober. They are relatively new I believe and I don’t know of studies comparing success rates. I bet the relapse rate is unfortunately high for spiritual and nonspiritual programs. Addiction is tough. At any rate no one is saying people can’t choose to be religious if they want to be just they shouldn’t force it on others or that people have to be religious. I know a lot people claim to find religion after making huge mistakes in life and trying to get through addictions but that doesn’t justify selling people fantasies. There are other ways of helping people overcome addictions, take responsibility for themselves, and make better choices but I guess they may take a bit more effort and work.

By: draecoiram

draecoiram — Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:11:21 +0000

i’m proof. used to be a meth addict. i was an atheist then, when i got off it, and now.

just because *you* haven’t seen anyone recover without a 12 step program doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. *you* have not seen everything there is, i assure you!